Steve Plater masterclass..I'm not worthy

[MarkG]

Seems to me that the process is becoming too complicated. Gas off, brakes on for approach, ease brakes off and flick her on in there for entry, slight throttle for corner, ease gas on for exit. Weight inside for stronger-gas-on-harder-exit.

All the shoulder rotation part is ok, just don't get hung up on it. Same with the butt slide over the seat part. Yea you can do it, but being smooth and not over-gripping the bars is the main thing. 80/20 rule. Do the basics right.

Too much thought process makes a rider stiff, which is the opposite of what you want. As far as the weight on the inside foot goes, try ice skating sometime with your weight on the inside foot.

I don't mean to sound like a know it all here, cause I certainly don't. What I do know is that the days I am in a relaxed, "enjoy the ride mind-set" is when I ride the best and usually fastest. And fastest without trying to be fast (this is relative of course). I would guess I am not alone in this.

[TP#12]

Originally Posted by MarkG

Seems to me that the process is becoming too complicated. Gas off, brakes on for approach, ease brakes off and flick her on in there for entry, slight throttle for corner, ease gas on for exit. Weight inside for stronger-gas-on-harder-exit.

All the shoulder rotation part is ok, just don't get hung up on it. Same with the butt slide over the seat part. Yea you can do it, but being smooth and not over-gripping the bars is the main thing. 80/20 rule. Do the basics right.

Too much thought process makes a rider stiff, which is the opposite of what you want. As far as the weight on the inside foot goes, try ice skating sometime with your weight on the inside foot.

I don't mean to sound like a know it all here, cause I certainly don't. What I do know is that the days I am in a relaxed, "enjoy the ride mind-set" is when I ride the best and usually fastest. And fastest without trying to be fast (this is relative of course). I would guess I am not alone in this.

You can weight the inside peg to help initiate the turn however this isn't necessary. You can turn a bike seriously fast just through countersteering, to the point where I can't really see a need to use any other force to turn the bike.

But you don't weight the inside peg to get on the gas harder on the exit, you weight the outside peg.

[MarkG]

Originally Posted by TP#12

You can weight the inside peg to help initiate the turn however this isn't necessary. You can turn a bike seriously fast just through countersteering, to the point where I can't really see a need to use any other force to turn the bike.

But you don't weight the inside peg to get on the gas harder on the exit, you weight the outside peg.

Quite so. On exit I refering to keeping your body inside, as in hanging off, not the inside foot. Applied force is still through the outside.

[TP#12]

Originally Posted by MarkG

Quite so. On exit I refering to keeping your body inside, as in hanging off, not the inside foot. Applied force is still through the outside.

Ahh, sorry. I misinterpreted what you said

Yep, hang off like a gibbon on the inside and try as hard as you can to snap the outside peg off with your foot!

[Desmo Dave]

Wow fascinating! This all very interesting and topical for me as I recently started experimenting with deliberately weighting my inside peg on turning after hearing Parrish mention something about it whilst commentating. personally I found it does really help on initiating the turn. Like someone said earlier I guess it's all about a combination of things and what suits different riders

[bradders]

if you want the basics, you can just buy a kieth code book and read it, its a Q of whether you can turn that into good habits without someone who knows what they are doing keeping you on track (no pun intended!)

interesting debate, a subject I know very little about.....common sense tells me if I put the majority of my bodywieght on the inside peg - essetially stamp on it, it will flop over quickly; if I shove the bars, it also tales an element of me 'leaning' in the same direction, this adding bodyweight, so has a similar altho not as sudden affect.

from a personal perspective, I find shoving the bars very tough, I have a habit of pulling, not pushing, and unless my elbows are below the bar height (not the most comfortable position!!) it doesnt work that well for me

different on track or a very spirited ride, when in a more racing-crouch

[MarkG]

Nick Ienatsch, who won the AMA 250gp class twice (I think) wrote a great book called "Sport Riding Techniques". He is also the lead instructor at the Freddie Spencer riding school, so he truely knows what works.

I would highly recommend this book for road and track riding skills improvement. The book has one chapter specific to steering and weighting. Ienatsch explains everything with enough theory to make it interesting without going off the deep end. I find myself going back to re-read parts of this book all the time. What he emphasizes above all else is to be smooth with control inputs.

[TP#12]

Originally Posted by MarkG

Nick Ienatsch, who won the AMA 250gp class twice (I think) wrote a great book called "Sport Riding Techniques". He is also the lead instructor at the Freddie Spencer riding school, so he truely knows what works.

I would highly recommend this book for road and track riding skills improvement. The book has one chapter specific to steering and weighting. Ienatsch explains everything with enough theory to make it interesting without going off the deep end. I find myself going back to re-read parts of this book all the time. What he emphasizes above all else is to be smooth with control inputs.

I'd be interested in having a read of this book. I might not be coaching anymoore but I'm still a real student of the technical side of riding and always trying to improve.

[NedLudd]

Originally Posted by TP#12

I'd be interested in having a read of this book. I might not be coaching anymoore but I'm still a real student of the technical side of riding and always trying to improve.

Amazon.co.uk: Sport Riding Techniques: How to Develop Real World Skills for Speed, Safety and Confidence on the Street and Track: Kenny Roberts, Nick Ienatsch: Books

[michaelb]

Originally Posted by Fireman

Ride it like a jockey does a racehorse. The only time your arse is in the saddle is when you're braking. You should have all yopur body weight on your legs and push on the pegs to turn the bike.

I've read this thread with interest.

Over the years I've done only a half-dozen track days, I'm no hero and am normally happy to plod around at my own pace. One of those days really stands out for me it was the one I did shortly after having spent the an entire ski season in the Alps skiing every day. (My skiing is pretty damn good - a sight better than my riding).

That day was a revelation. I was fit after three months in the mountains and I found a lot of skiing techniques carry over to track riding. There are two fundamentals in skiing that you have to nail or you'll be all at sea: (1) always stay crouched and flexible and (2) keep your weight forward. With my fitness levels up I had no trouble "riding it like a jockey" and it just felt so good. I could see an instant improvement in my riding.

[Jolley]

Originally Posted by TP#12

Ahh, sorry. I misinterpreted what you said

Yep, hang off like a gibbon on the inside and try as hard as you can to snap the outside peg off with your foot!

Part of Level 3 of CSS had us standing the bike up whilst we hung off the inside getting the power on. Instead of putting weight on the outside peg though, we were "reverse counter steering"!!... .so coming out of a left hander, stay hanging off of the left of the bike, and as you get on the throttle pull the left hand bar towards you (or push the right away if you prefer). It feels odd at first and takes a bit of getting used to, but with time you can start getting on the throttle nice and early whilst still exiting the turn (and the bike is more upright so less prone to highsiding). I think that is in essence the same thing, but using steering input rather than weight on the pegs.

(apologies if someone has already mentioned this... I was lazy and have only read the last page)

[TP#12]

Originally Posted by Jolley

Part of Level 3 of CSS had us standing the bike up whilst we hung off the inside getting the power on. Instead of putting weight on the outside peg though, we were "reverse counter steering"!!... .so coming out of a left hander, stay hanging off of the left of the bike, and as you get on the throttle pull the left hand bar towards you (or push the right away if you prefer). It feels odd at first and takes a bit of getting used to, but with time you can start getting on the throttle nice and early whilst still exiting the turn (and the bike is more upright so less prone to highsiding). I think that is in essence the same thing, but using steering input rather than weight on the pegs.

(apologies if someone has already mentioned this... I was lazy and have only read the last page)

You're supposed to do both. Push the outside bar or pull the inside one (I prefer pushing the outside one) and weight the outside peg. Weighting the outside peg allows you to 'feel' what the rear is doing.

I was a CSS riding coach for 3 years.